SPN 516

[lexzilla]

Huh. I've been flitting round lj reading some of the reaction posts to 'Dark Side of the Moon. Lots of interesting things being said, but reactions can be boiled down to three points of view:

1. YAY SPN!!
2. YAY SAM!! SPN SUCKS!!
3. YAY DEAN!! WOOT SPN!!

I'd like to think I fall into camp one. But it's possible there's a shade of camp three. So WARNING FOR EMOTIONAL ATTACHMENT BIAS.

Which probably leads to my first thought which is - how much of an episode do you think is written with Jensen's awesome ability to do close-ups in mind? If I had that face/ability to work with when I was writing something, you'd be damn sure it would show up a lot. And it does. And I see this not as a knock against Jared and more just a yay for Jensen. So, bias...

I've got to say, as sad and as hopeless as this episode was, I thought it was great. I know camp twoers were seeing Sam's memories as a way to further pull Sam from any emotional arc this season and as a dig against him, but I really saw it as consistent characterisation.

In Dean's 'I wuv hugs' [AWWWWWWW] memory, although it wasn't perfect, it was family and home and love and safety and Sam wasn't there. Sam didn't experience it. Sam was excluded from it. Sam's notion of family is all post John turns into a hunter. Yes he had Dean but it also had violence and abandonment and the fundamental notion that hunting comes first [again, I'll reiterate that this is fartherly learnings, not what he got from Dean, but Dad shapes the family] and he saw that version of family and thought 'meh'. Dean, on the other hand, had the two versions of family and so all of post-Mary life can be compared to pre-Mary and fuck him up and give him those issues. Gah! I'm being woefully inarticulate, but hopefully you know what I'm trying to say.

I also didn't see Dean dropping the amulet into the trash as abandonment of Sammy. I read it as a total abandonment of hope. And in a way this nicely places Sam back into the role of 'brother with faith' that we saw in 'Houses of the Holy' which I hope will pave the way for Sam's self-redemption. He needs to get pas the place where he feels like he shouldn't be in heaven.

Did anyone else think that Pamela's maybe you should give in to Michael was just a little off and creepy? Something going on there on clunky dialogue?

Kurt Fuller is awesome. Y/Y?

Castiel's mirroring of Dean in this episode worked really well.

"It's like Disneyland but without the anti-semitism" BWAH HA HA My favourite line.

Cinematography FTW!

I'm unsure about Joshua. Liked the actor, but magical gardener seems a tad problematic.

Oh man, I think this is possibly the most thoughtful reaction to an episode I've ever had.

Comments

[to-question.livejournal.com]

I saw the dropping of the amulet the same way. It's not about Sam, it's about the fact that Dean was putting his faith in God to fix things or to just care about fixing things and God checked out (refused to answer his phone, like another father figure). And I'm with you in camp 1. I love both brothers and I don't get why it always have to be Yay!Dean or Yay!Sam. You are far more articulate than me. I'll I can think is that this episode gutted me and I came away from it wanting to weep for both the boys.

Jensen's close-ups are amazing. And yeah, something was off about Pamela and Joshua. I'm thinking something wasn't supposed to add up.

[sans-gene.livejournal.com]

I also see this episode as setting up the path for Sam's redemption. For me it was the most emotionally connected I've felt to Sam in a long time. It was heartbreakingly clear that Dean's pretty much lost right now and only Sam can fix him. On a side note, how come Dean and Sam were fully clothed while sleeping? They even had their boots on. I know its selfish of me, but a little less layering would have been more realistic.

[lexzilla.livejournal.com]

Agreed! I mean, I can kinda see why people would think it meant Sam in that moment but it makes no sense in the context of the whole episode. The boys aren't fighting. They aren't against each other. It was god that they were looking for answers from and who disappointed them. You're spot on with the rejection of the father figure [real or magical] thing IMO.

It was a very emotional. I think pretty much everyone left this episode feeling like that.

Gah! His faaaaace!

[lexzilla.livejournal.com]

Yeah. It feels a little like its heralding a return to a season 2 like dynamic between the boys. Dean has been weary for a long long time and it will make Sam feel so much better to be the one leading for a while.

Hahaha. I agree!

[matalinolukaret.livejournal.com]

I agree with you on Pamela. She seemed a little off to me, but I wasn't sure if it was the writing or it's on purpose.

As for the whole amulet thing, I can see it both ways. It could be a physical interpretation of the faith or fight Dean had just being thrown away. I mean, God was pretty much his last hope for holding out on Michael, he's gotta be upset. I don't think he's dumping Sam, but Sam could see it that way. It's possible.

But I also agree with the fact that now it's Sam that has the drive to fight, a la season 3 with Dean's deal.

Oh and family! I can see it as Dean post-Mary as fighting to at least have that sense of family he had before, that even without Mary they're still a family, and he values that. Sam on the other hand didn't get to experience mom cutting up his pbj and tucking him in at night and he's stuck with a mostly absent father bent on revenge and Dean trying to act as a Mother-Father-Brother all at once. It's gonna be screwed up and I don't think Sam ever really saw Dean in a negative way as a child than he did John.

Now my brain's all screwy, bah.

Kurt Fuller was so deliciously evil in this episode I loved it. :) Taunting, punching, sneering, oh yes.

And I love Ash. ♥ Let's all go to Winchesterland!

I loved how creepy the actor for Joshua seemed. I mean, he didn't blink in any of his scenes, it was awesome.

I have a feeling this is one episode I'll be rewatching a lot, even if it did make me yell at my tv. :P

[moorspede.livejournal.com]

And the way he reacted to Cas's emotional crisis *hearts*

I haven't seen any type two reactions. It was nice to see the point made that John's and Dean's memories of family life pre- Azazel were a little unrealistic. I felt a little more sympathetic to Sam's situation, and of course, he was getting away from the *situation*, not Dean. Poor Dean for having all that thrown in his face again.

You already know I was too knocked out by the awesomeness that is Jensen and Misha to see the amulet being binned but it may indicate his despair at what he sees as Sam's betrayal of him. So much of a burden to place on such young shoulders and to have Sam's happiest memories being of getting away (from him). (We were made aware that) Sam is Dean's soul mate, whatever that is.

But yeah, Dean could be just pissed off with God, also. Maybe it's a little of both? We'll see.

I also think Kurt Fuller is awesome but I'm having trouble with his character. It's not sitting with me well, everytime I try to understand why it escapes me. :o( The ruthlessness doesn't fit somehow.

Poor Castiel's lost everything except the guys, I want to hug him.

*laughs* Yeah that line was awesome.

Joshua has an interesting history, perhaps we'll see him again in the final ep of the season?

[nicefeet.livejournal.com]

Yes, yes, yes. I have read so much meta on this episode now that I just need to see what happens next.

I'm glad the God issue is dealt with and that they've removed that deus ex machina. I love what dodger_winslow has to say (http://dodger-winslow.livejournal.com/222262.html) about the parallels between God and John and the role of a father in SPN.

Don't leave me hanging, show! I want redemption and hero-arcs and destiny and free-will. And after this episode, I KNOW THEY CAN DO IT.

[lexzilla.livejournal.com]

Yeah Even thinking about that scene now, I still can't decide!

That's true about the amulet! But I think at this point Sam's seen enough of Dean's head-space to [hopefully!] not be upset by it! But then I'm hearing stuff coming out the cons of things getting worse before they get better...OUCHY :(

Hahahaha. The show does cause crazy-making thoughts :D But I agree that Sam never thought of Dean like John.

Kurt Fuller rules. atimi illustrated how he made JAZZ HANDS at the lion face comment and that might just be the most awesome thing ever. Still laughing.

He didn't blink? Man, I failed on noticing that. *sigh* I'm gonna have to rewatch... *BEAMS*

LOL. I understand exactly.

[lexzilla.livejournal.com]

*sniffles*

Oh man. I saw loads. Astolats flist I think??? It was all along the lines of how annoying it is to always get the show from Deans POV, how Dean was being mean to Sam by being upset over Stanford, how you the show ruins Sams character by showing those specific memories blah blah blah

I know! Poor both boys!

Yeah, it is possible it means that. But I think its just more of a giving up in general thing. I haven't watched any JIB con footage yet, but I heard that Jensen said the boys relationship will have to get worse before it gets better! That's gonna be a big OUCH. LOL the soulmates line was awesome.

Huh. I get what you're saying. I tend to view Zacharia as a middle management flunky. The type that's always an arse. I don't know whose orders he's working under though...

Castiels end face was soooooooo sad. *g* You want to cuddle him don't you?

What's the history? [we've already covered my biblical ignorance so...]

[lexzilla.livejournal.com]

Me too! And thank god there is an episode next week. It feels like every time the show has gained momentum this season, it then stops for a hiatus. So frustrating. And a little damaging to the myth arc. I'm thinking that watching the series on DVD will be a very different experience.

Thanks for the link. That was interesting.

Hee. I THINK SO TOO <333

[moorspede.livejournal.com]

Middle management of Zachariah's ilk may actually go rogue without his boss on the reigns. He may be part of a cartel rather than doing someone's business.

Worse before it gets better... We are going out this season the way we did last season? Boo.

Straight from wiki - Joshua was one of the twelve spies of Israel sent by Moses to explore the land of Canaan. After the death of Moses, he led the Israelite tribes in the conquest of Canaan, and allocated the land to the tribes.